[najafi]

A Follower, on Nov 18 2006, 12:40 AM, said:

I am sure that Bro Karbala would have seen the video prior to the posting. As for what you have posted here are some questions my friend:

if he had seen it and understood it why did he then ask "what are these reasons" ?????

A Follower, on Nov 18 2006, 12:40 AM, said:

- Was Sayed Mohammad not a resident of Qum?
- His grave was accessible to the men and women alike. It was only recently that they changed the way and only women are allowed in that section. However the household of Shirazis have always been able to visit the grave so who said no men can visit?

yes he was a resident of qum but it was his will to be buried in his own house after his death.
can you tell me why only the household of shirazis and the women are allowed to visit his grave and the public are not allowed to visit an ayatollah's grave in an islamic country?

A Follower, on Nov 18 2006, 12:40 AM, said:

- Lastly as for the women beating can you proof that it happened? Were you there? I was there and I can assure you the way the Sayed has made it out it was no where near there.

brother you need to read my posts properly.i do not need to prove that women were beaten or not i just said what the sayed is saying and i did not say if it is true or not. he is sayed mohamed shirazi's brother so i would say he knows better than me or you that what actually happened.

A Follower, on Nov 18 2006, 12:40 AM, said:

Oh and another point to note here: This person in the video is cursing and comparing Imam Khomeini to the Caliphs. Also note that Imam Khomeini was a teacher of this person now if cursing a teacher of the calibre of Imam Khomeini is what Islam has taught us then we are in grave error. The person should at least show some respect for his teacher who was not even around at the death of Sayed Mohammad Shirazi nor alive at the time of this so called 'Women beating'

can you prove that sayed khomeini was his teacher?

[najafi]

Karbala110, on Nov 18 2006, 01:09 AM, said:

EVEN if they say things that may boil your blood, like insulting on leadership(rahbar), you have to show patience and be quiet.

Even if they burn and destroy a picture of me, you HAVE to remain silent and save your energy for the day that the country truly needs it.

Save it for the day that the energy of youth, momeen, and hizbullahi is needed to stand up against the enemy. Let's say an ignorant student says something, so what?

so if he really believes in what you just mentioned can you tell me why sayed shirazi was treated like that??/

[A Follower]

najafi, on Nov 18 2006, 01:06 AM, said:

if he had seen it and understood it why did he then ask "what are these reasons" ?????

Bro read the very first post by Bro Karbala on this thread and read where he talks about how this person curses Imam Khomeini and others. Click here! His reasons for asking is that why does this person has a tendency to cause unprovoked attacks on Imam Khomeini and other learned scholars.

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yes he was a resident of qum but it was his will to be buried in his own house after his death.
can you tell me why only the household of shirazis and the women are allowed to visit his grave and the public are not allowed to visit an ayatollah's grave in an islamic country?

Bro I would really like you to stop saying things which you are unaware of. I have visited his grave on a few occasions and that also with a few members of the Shirazi family and alot of the followers of Sayed Sadiq have access to the grave since they come with the members of Shirazi family. Secondly yes the grave is in the women side but what about the graves of Allama Tabatabai and Shaheed Muthahari they are on the men's side. How is that justified for the women? Are you saying that they should move the graves to a place where all public can access?

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brother you need to read my posts properly.i do not need to prove that women were beaten or not i just said what the sayed is saying and i did not say if it is true or not. he is sayed mohamed shirazi's brother so i would say he knows better than me or you that what actually happened.

Bro I was there as I stated hence that makes me an eye witness to this incident. Are you accusing me of lying? And the personality in the video was in London and the incident has supposed to take place in Qum. I dont see the connection there. Maybe you can elaborate.

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can you prove that sayed khomeini was his teacher?

If I am not mistaken you are from London. So please pay him a visit and ask him yourself like I did when I had the chance to meet him. His early Islamic Studies were taught by Imam Khomeini. It is a known fact amongst those who know this personality very well. More to that on one occasion he himself said that the greatest scholar he met is the one whom he curses day and night. Maybe I am confused here but why is he saying Imam Khomeini was the greatest scholar he met and yet he curses him?

Wsalaams

[najafi]

A Follower, on Nov 18 2006, 01:29 AM, said:

Bro I would really like you to stop saying things which you are unaware of. I have visited his grave on a few occasions and that also with a few members of the Shirazi family and alot of the followers of Sayed Sadiq have access to the grave since they come with the members of Shirazi family.

bro read my post again i said public, the followers of sayed sadiq are not public.

A Follower, on Nov 18 2006, 01:29 AM, said:

Secondly yes the grave is in the women side but what about the graves of Allama Tabatabai and Shaheed Muthahari they are on the men's side. How is that justified for the women? Are you saying that they should move the graves to a place where all public can access?

the men are supose to be buried on the men's side especially if the guy is an ayatollah just as you mentioned allama tabatabai and shaheed mutahari are buried on the men's side i want to know why sayed mohamed shirazi was buried on the women's side.

A Follower, on Nov 18 2006, 01:29 AM, said:

Bro I was there as I stated hence that makes me an eye witness to this incident. Are you accusing me of lying?

again i need to tell you to read my posts properly i said i believe he knows better than us because he is sayed mohammed's brother.

A Follower, on Nov 18 2006, 01:29 AM, said:

And the personality in the video was in London and the incident has supposed to take place in Qum. I dont see the connection there. Maybe you can elaborate.

are you saying he is not allowed to talk about how his family are treated?

A Follower, on Nov 18 2006, 01:29 AM, said:

If I am not mistaken you are from London. So please pay him a visit and ask him yourself like I did when I had the chance to meet him. His early Islamic Studies were taught by Imam Khomeini. It is a known fact amongst those who know this personality very well. More to that on one occasion he himself said that the greatest scholar he met is the one whom he curses day and night. Maybe I am confused here but why is he saying Imam Khomeini was the greatest scholar he met and yet he curses him?

you need to provide evidance.is any recording? "i heard it" is not simply enough.

Cyan_Garamond, on Nov 18 2006, 01:32 AM, said:

If a follower of Sayyid Muhammad Shirazi assaults me can I straight-away blame the deceased alim? Of course, I cannot; and neither can you blame Imam Khomeini for some perceived offenses against Shirazi et al.

there is a difference here.anyone can be a follower of shirazi but those who took actions against shirazi were not only followers of sayed khomeini or khamenei but they were given power by them to do so.

Cyan_Garamond, on Nov 18 2006, 01:32 AM, said:

Now, about this burial issue. Tell me, is the agenda of Shirazi more important than the integrity and security of the Islamic Republic?

Are the personal agendas of the Shirazi family/group more important than the unity of Shias worldwide?

What is a group based on one household versus the entire Islamic Republic/system?

are you saying that shirazis had no right to decide where sayed mohammed should be buried just because the islamic republic did not want them to.

Cyan_Garamond, on Nov 18 2006, 01:32 AM, said:

What have the Shirazis done for Islam, regionally and worldwide, versus the Islamic Republic? I agree both have their achievements, but the Islamic Republic is a firm foundation and a funder/helper of Shias worldwide, in various capacities. Now, obviously we cannot expect them to save all the Shias of Iraq, Pakistan, etc. However, they do indeed help. They are Shia power and armed military force. They bolstered the Shias of Lebanon and nurtured Hezbollah. Had it not been for Iran, according to Naserallah, Hezbollah would not be what it is. We can say that, if not for this 'duo', South Lebanon would be similar to West Bank (Nawzubillah).

you can not compare shirazis to the iranian government.shirazi was only an ayatollah but iran is a country.just so you know iran also supports palestinians who earlier said that saddam who killed thousands of iranians in the iran-iraq war should not be hanged.

Cyan_Garamond, on Nov 18 2006, 01:32 AM, said:

IF Shirazi's Will and the actions and agenda of his group harm the Islamic Republic and integrity of Shias and Muslims worldwide, something must be done about these reckless and irresponsible people. Will I allow my friend to cause harm to the interests of the entire society just because he is my friend? No, God willing, I will do something about him--I will do my duty to stop this foolish person.

is the islamic republic acting as ma3soom here????? are you telling me that they are the only shia and they make no mistakes? do they have every righte to take actions against anyone just because they are the islamic republic????

[A Follower]

najafi, on Nov 18 2006, 02:28 AM, said:

bro read my post again i said public, the followers of sayed sadiq are not public.

Bro yes you said public but please go and have a look as to how many people do visit his grave. I am not a follower of Sayed Sadiq Shirazi yet I was able to go and not just with the members of Shirazi family.

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the men are supose to be buried on the men's side especially if the guy is an ayatollah just as you mentioned allama tabatabai and shaheed mutahari are buried on the men's side i want to know why sayed mohamed shirazi was buried on the women's side.

At the time of his burial both men and women had the access to that place. Later on they changed it and it became women's section. Here is a question to you when was the last time you went to Qum? If you have been in the last two years you would notice how greatly the Shrine has changed. Also Allama Tabatabai and Shaheed Muthahari died many years before Sayed Mohammad hence when they were buried the structure and the section of men and women of the Shrine would have been very different from today. Who knows maybe when they were buried their graves were in women's section too and later on they made that men's section.

There has been new additions in terms of structure due to which the sections of women and men have changed again. So as I asked before are you saying that a seperate place should be made for the graves where both men and women can visit?

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again i need to tell you to read my posts properly i said i believe he knows better than us because he is sayed mohammed's brother.

Agreed he knows better but my point was that I was there as an eye witness thats all.

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are you saying he is not allowed to talk about how his family are treated?

No I am not saying that he should stop talking about his family at all my point was that he was in London at the time of the incident thats all.

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you need to provide evidance.is any recording? "i heard it" is not simply enough.

Well bro I dont need to provide evidence of this as I said you live in London and I am sure Wembley is not far from you where he lives so you can visit him and ask him yourself. Or if you are on SC then please take a look at the posts of 'Casper' who himself has mentioned this. He is a Shirazi follower. For me I have heard that from him and others who are close to him and I am content with that.

Wsalaams

[najafi]

Cyan_Garamond, on Nov 18 2006, 02:44 AM, said:

Once again, I am saying that if it is an act that leads to great fitna and promotion of anti-IRI streams, I am against it and it must be put down. If that means Muhammad Shirazi cannot be buried in his own home, so be it. He is not more important than the system.

may i ask how burying an ayatollah in his own house leads to a fitna???

Cyan_Garamond, on Nov 18 2006, 02:44 AM, said:

How foolish this statement is. Please reflect more. Iran does not support Palestinians because they have such ideas or because they are Arab, etc. Iran supports them only because they are an Islamic nation and cause and thereby entirely relevant to the whole Muslim world.

what you are saying is absolute nonsense.why iran did not support iraq then???? they were a muslim nation too.

Cyan_Garamond, on Nov 18 2006, 02:44 AM, said:

Everyone makes mistakes. However, what Imam Khomeini and his group have done for Shias and Muslims is much more than what others have done. The Shirazi group, and I respect their achievements, are negligible--like crumbs--next to Khomeini. It took Khomeini to creation an independent Muslim nation based on the divine and complete principles of Islam; no one else could have done that. 100 Shirazis could not equal even 1 Khomeini, truth be told.

where in islam says a muslim or even greater an ayatollah cant be buried where he wants to????

[najafi]

A Follower, on Nov 18 2006, 03:00 AM, said:

Bro yes you said public but please go and have a look as to how many people do visit his grave. I am not a follower of Sayed Sadiq Shirazi yet I was able to go and not just with the members of Shirazi family.

bro i am sure we cant go because it is actually on the women's side and you are not allowed to go there it is just that simple.

A Follower, on Nov 18 2006, 03:00 AM, said:

At the time of his burial both men and women had the access to that place. Later on they changed it and it became women's section. Here is a question to you when was the last time you went to Qum? If you have been in the last two years you would notice how greatly the Shrine has changed. Also Allama Tabatabai and Shaheed Muthahari died many years before Sayed Mohammad hence when they were buried the structure and the section of men and women of the Shrine would have been very different from today. Who knows maybe when they were buried their graves were in women's section too and later on they made that men's section.

bro you can not base your talks on something you do not know.the question is that why his grave was put on the women's side. as you said many people want to visit his grave so why would they do such thing?the only reason i can think of is to stop people visiting his grave.

A Follower, on Nov 18 2006, 03:00 AM, said:

There has been new additions in terms of structure due to which the sections of women and men have changed again. So as I asked before are you saying that a seperate place should be made for the graves where both men and women can visit?

as i said earlier he is a man and ayatollah so he should be buried on the men's side.it does not really matter if women cant visit his grave.

A Follower, on Nov 18 2006, 03:00 AM, said:

No I am not saying that he should stop talking about his family at all my point was that he was in London at the time of the incident thats all.

bro just a phone call from qum which takes about 2 minutes can make everything clear for him.he does not actually need to be there.

A Follower, on Nov 18 2006, 03:00 AM, said:

Well bro I dont need to provide evidence of this as I said you live in London and I am sure Wembley is not far from you where he lives so you can visit him and ask him yourself. Or if you are on SC then please take a look at the posts of 'Casper' who himself has mentioned this. He is a Shirazi follower. For me I have heard that from him and others who are close to him and I am content with that.

well if you do not need to provide evidance i cant accept what you are saying.i do not really see any need to go and visit him because you are the one who needs to back what you said earlier with evidance.

[Guardian]

Salaamu Alaikum

For people sitting in UK and USA to be debating something that transpired a few years ago whereby a deceased was not allowed to be buried in his home according to local authority regulations is hardly a mantle piece to decide the fate of a Shia Muslim worldwide community. I suggest you all grow up and realise that there is far more at stake. Although it is shocking to see the comments made by Mujtaba Shirazi, I really don't expect any better given that this is what some people in the community want to hear anyway. We need to breed a sense of unity and empower each other rather than continue in this culture of disruptive, destructive and disorderly behaviour that we as Shias are so accustomed to seeing these days.

[A Follower]

najafi, on Nov 18 2006, 03:28 AM, said:

bro i am sure we cant go because it is actually on the women's side and you are not allowed to go there it is just that simple.

Maybe if you say it is that simple then please tell me as to how the men of the Shirazi family go every week?

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bro you can not base your talks on something you do not know.the question is that why his grave was put on the women's side. as you said many people want to visit his grave so why would they do such thing?the only reason i can think of is to stop people visiting his grave.

Bro did you even read the full statement before making your comment. Allama Tabatabai passed away in the 70s and Shaheed Muthahari passed away before the climax of the revolution hence if you look at the history of the Shrine you will see how it has progressed and transformed. So when I said who knows their graves might have been in the women's section it means that when they were buried it could have been but now due to the transformation of the Shrine in its structure has changed that. Same happened with the grave of Sayed Mohammad. When he was buried both men and women were allowed to visit him now due to the structural changes men cannot visit. However that hasnt prevent the Shirazi family to visit the grave as for the public there has been occasion where the public ie the men specifically have been allowed to visit the grave on occasions like his death annivesary etc.

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as i said earlier he is a man and ayatollah so he should be buried on the men's side.it does not really matter if women cant visit his grave.

Bro let me just mention one thing here. If you have good relations in Qum please ask them to provide you with a map of the Shrine along with the graves marked of all those who are buried with the vicinty of the Shrine and you will see that the graves are scattered all over. The grave of Sayed Mohammad is not the only one in the women's section, there are many other men buried in that section.

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bro just a phone call from qum which takes about 2 minutes can make everything clear for him.he does not actually need to be there.

Oh thanks I did not know that he had relations in Qum but yea thanks for that!

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well if you do not need to provide evidance i cant accept what you are saying.i do not really see any need to go and visit him because you are the one who needs to back what you said earlier with evidance.

Bro it is a well known fact maybe you wish to deny it since I have no recording but I am sure you living in London can easily find out if you wanted. However denial is your route not mine! and with that lets end it here for this is just going in circles.

If you wish to know that Imam Khomeini was his teacher you can ask many people you dont even need to visit him, you can ask all those scholars which come to london in Muharram and Ramadan to speak such as Qazwinis and Modaressis they are related to him and know this very well and I am sure you being in London would have or will be interacting with them at some point so please ask them.

Wsalaams

[najafi]

Cyan_Garamond, on Nov 18 2006, 03:34 AM, said:

Please understand that the ayatollah and burial, in themselves, are not an issue. The issue is: What are the consequences and implications of such an event? The family or supporters of Shirazi, or those who want to take advantage of his name, may indeed use it to spread propaganda against the Islamic Republic. For example, they can say 'the late Shirazi was so opposed to IRI that he insisted on being buried inside his own home'. Thereby, he is made a 'martyr' or symbol of all those who are against IRI and this will further help their agenda in creating division. The gullible and unsuspecting people may become victim to it.

can you tell me what difference did burying him in the shrine make?his followers and even his own brother are saying he was opposed to the iranian government and still call him shaheed.i believe the government just gave them more excuses to do such things.
also there are other ayatollahs who were buried in their houses, offices or mosques such as sayed brujerdi, sayed mohammed rohani, sayed mesbah and aqa najafi maraashi.what was so especial about sayed mohammed shirazi?

Cyan_Garamond, on Nov 18 2006, 03:34 AM, said:

Imam Khomeini supported teh Muslim people of Iraq and asked them to rise up, which some did and became shaheed for. Others gave valient resistance and had to flee. We know all that. Additionally, Palestine is a territorially (not by heart) conquered nation, having been under the rule of the Zionists for decades. They were/are a brutalized and oppressed people. The same can be said for Iraq, but unfortunately it was so-called Muslims who did that in that case. We must always be careful not to give our enemies chances to further divide us because you that it will make us all weaker. Unfortunately, this is perhaps why some more restraint was given on this issue.

when did sayed khomeini ask the iraqis to rise up.if you are talking about the uprising in 1991 that had nothing to do with sayed khomeini.
so in other words iran is supporting people who support iran's enemy, no matter if they are muslim that is just stupid.

Cyan_Garamond, on Nov 18 2006, 03:34 AM, said:

However, Iran has helped Iraq tremendously; they took in so many refugees (some of whom have made Iran their homes) and have formed the SCIRI, and many other measures.

bro i need to correct you.iran is not helping iraq.iran is helping people such as moqtada sadr and his army.they provide them with guns and money so they can destroy iraq more.

Guardian, on Nov 18 2006, 03:35 AM, said:

For people sitting in UK and USA to be debating something that transpired a few years ago whereby a deceased was not allowed to be buried in his home according to local authority regulations

i hope you realise that there is so much difference btween just a deceased and an ayatollah especially in an islamic country.

A Follower, on Nov 18 2006, 03:50 AM, said:

Maybe if you say it is that simple then please tell me as to how the men of the Shirazi family go every week?

as you just said it is not every day it is every week. so that means there is some especial time when only shirazis are allowed to go there when that part of shrine is closed for women.

A Follower, on Nov 18 2006, 03:50 AM, said:

So when I said who knows their graves might have been in the women's section it means that when they were buried it could have been but now due to the transformation of the Shrine in its structure has changed that.

bro read my post again.i said when you say their graves might have been in the women's section it means you are not sure about it. and you can not base your talks on something which you do not even know if it is true.

A Follower, on Nov 18 2006, 03:50 AM, said:

The grave of Sayed Mohammad is not the only one in the women's section, there are many other men buried in that section.

can you tell me which other ayatollah is buried in the women's section?

A Follower, on Nov 18 2006, 03:50 AM, said:

Oh thanks I did not know that he had relations in Qum but yea thanks for that!

no problem, but if you dont know something you should not talk about it then

[A Follower]

najafi, on Nov 18 2006, 04:42 PM, said:

as you just said it is not every day it is every week. so that means there is some especial time when only shirazis are allowed to go there when that part of shrine is closed for women.

Bro the relations of Shirazi families ie his grandson who studies in Qum has his classes right near the Shrine and they pray the Magrib Namaz at the Shrine and then they go to visit the grave. I went with Sayed Mohammad's grandson hence I know and it is the routine that these guys do every day unless they are out of Qum. As for those who are no residing in Qum comes once a week that is a known thing which I have seen since I was in Qum this summer.

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bro read my post again.i said when you say their graves might have been in the women's section it means you are not sure about it. and you can not base your talks on something which you do not even know if it is true.

And you missed my point too. Are you saying you know the history of the Shrine from the time it was built till today? And how many structural changes have happened? If you do then yes it is easy to work out where the graves might have been in the Shrine at the time of their death. Also bro I am sure you must have visited Qum and the Shrine. Next time please take a few mins and visit the office in the Shrine and ask them for a history of the Shrine and they will provide you with a book or a leaflet which has pictures. You will notice that the Shrine today was no where near as big or as large in the olden days hence there has been structural improvements which means that only a person who has served in the Shrine is aware of where the graves might have been at the time of burial and from that point onwards. I have asked these people and even they themselves say that the graves where they are now wasnt the men section before. So what does that imply? two options: either it was outside the main part of the Shrine meaning where the Zaree is and since the extension it came under the main part? Or it could have been in the women's section? Now I guess upon my next visit I shall find out which of the two options fit. Stay tuned!

And I am basing my talk on the information obtained from the Shrine. I dont speak beeswax so please stop going in circles and degrading each other.

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can you tell me which other ayatollah is buried in the women's section?

Please check this link. It is a small book complied by Sheikh Abbas Virjee abt the Ulema buried in the Holy City of Qum within the Shrine and around the Shrine and outside the Shrine. However please note that the information he has included is after years of research as he has spent a few years in Qum and upon his return he wrote this:
Ulemas
Maybe the book will answer your question.

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no problem, but if you dont know something you should not talk about it then

That was sarcasm! of course I know he has relations I met his brother Sadiq Shirazi. Did you forget to see that?

Wsalaams

[najafi]

A Follower, on Nov 18 2006, 06:00 PM, said:

I went with Sayed Mohammad's grandson hence I know and it is the routine that these guys do every day unless they are out of Qum. As for those who are no residing in Qum comes once a week that is a known thing which I have seen since I was in Qum this summer.

bro just keep reading my posts untill you really understand what i am saying instead of replying without even understanding my question.i have at least asked you about 3 times that are the public allowed to visit his grave everyday anytime?

A Follower, on Nov 18 2006, 06:00 PM, said:

two options: either it was outside the main part of the Shrine meaning where the Zaree is and since the extension it came under the main part? Or it could have been in the women's section? Now I guess upon my next visit I shall find out which of the two options fit. Stay tuned!

so there is no point repeating yourself untill you actually go to qum again and ask them if the graves where in the women's section

A Follower, on Nov 18 2006, 06:00 PM, said:

Please check this link. It is a small book complied by Sheikh Abbas Virjee abt the Ulema buried in the Holy City of Qum within the Shrine and around the Shrine and outside the Shrine. However please note that the information he has included is after years of research as he has spent a few years in Qum and upon his return he wrote this:
Ulemas
Maybe the book will answer your question.

bro all i asked for was a name of an ayatollah who is buried in the women's section.no point giving me a book just mention one name that is enough.

A Follower, on Nov 18 2006, 06:00 PM, said:

of course I know he has relations I met his brother Sadiq Shirazi.

if you have met his brother and know about his relations in qum so why do you still make such a stupid comments?if he has a brother in qum why does he need to be in qum to find out what actually happened?instead he can just ask his brother on the phone

[A Follower]

najafi, on Nov 19 2006, 01:38 AM, said:

bro just keep reading my posts untill you really understand what i am saying instead of replying without even understanding my question.i have at least asked you about 3 times that are the public allowed to visit his grave everyday anytime?

And I have answered you enough times maybe you suffer from selective reading. His family visits the grave on regular basis and the public is allowed to visit openly on certain occasions one of them being his death annivesary.

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so there is no point repeating yourself untill you actually go to qum again and ask them if the graves where in the women's section

Instead of telling me that why dont you trouble yourself and do that. At least I managed to get this much info while all you are doing is speculating.

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bro all i asked for was a name of an ayatollah who is buried in the women's section.no point giving me a book just mention one name that is enough.

I provided you the book so you can see how many Ayatollahs and Great Ulemas are buried there and where they are buried in the Shrine. If you had looked at the book you wouldnt have written the ignorant comment you did.

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if you have met his brother and know about his relations in qum so why do you still make such a stupid comments?if he has a brother in qum why does he need to be in qum to find out what actually happened?instead he can just ask his brother on the phone

No it was not a stupid comment it was sarcasm something which your post is also full of so dont preach others while you do the same thing. Secondly my point of talking abt his relations is that if his brother in Qum knows about this video why hasnt he issued a statement against it? Especially after Sayed Sadiq himself has asked his followers to stop causing problems and to try and build good relations. So what does this show? basically if a two min phone call can make him aware of what goes on in Qum then surely a 2 min phone call would have also told him the stance of his brother, the Marja of the followers, Sayed Sadiq and what he has said to his followers. Now if this person is still going and insulting scholars then what does that show? I mean what happened to the relations in Qum then? Did they go AWOL?

[Istish'hadi]

Brother Najafi, sorry to say but it is evident that you do not argue out of the intention to make clear what is right, rather it is obvious that your arguements are baseless, senseless and are based on your negative and biased stance towards the Islamic Republic of Iran and Ayatollah Khamenai(HA). Your bias is clear and your stance towards the Republic and the Revolution is evident in all your posts.

I suggest that my open minded and educated brethren not engage in such obscure dialogue that posses's all the characteristics of ignorance.

[najafi]

A Follower, on Nov 19 2006, 02:35 AM, said:

And I have answered you enough times maybe you suffer from selective reading. His family visits the grave on regular basis and the public is allowed to visit openly on certain occasions one of them being his death annivesary.

exactly that is the whole point bro.all i having been trying to say all this time is that the iranian government stopped the public to visit his grave regularly.

A Follower, on Nov 19 2006, 02:35 AM, said:

Instead of telling me that why dont you trouble yourself and do that. At least I managed to get this much info while all you are doing is speculating.

bro the information you hav got only tells us that those graves were not in the men's section before but it does not mean they were in the women's section so why bother to get such infromation??

A Follower, on Nov 19 2006, 02:35 AM, said:

I provided you the book so you can see how many Ayatollahs and Great Ulemas are buried there and where they are buried in the Shrine. If you had looked at the book you wouldnt have written the ignorant comment you did.

bro i did look at the book but all i asked for was one name not a 29 page book.so why dont you just give a name?

A Follower, on Nov 19 2006, 02:35 AM, said:

No it was not a stupid comment it was sarcasm something which your post is also full of so dont preach others while you do the same thing. Secondly my point of talking abt his relations is that if his brother in Qum knows about this video why hasnt he issued a statement against it? Especially after Sayed Sadiq himself has asked his followers to stop causing problems and to try and build good relations. So what does this show? basically if a two min phone call can make him aware of what goes on in Qum then surely a 2 min phone call would have also told him the stance of his brother, the Marja of the followers, Sayed Sadiq and what he has said to his followers. Now if this person is still going and insulting scholars then what does that show? I mean what happened to the relations in Qum then? Did they go AWOL?

your comments are stupid because if you use just abit of common sense you will see that sayed sadiq is living in iran so of course he can not say things like his brother in public because he will be jailed.also when his brother knows about this video and has not issued an statement against it proves that he just agrees with what sayed mujtaba is saying.

[Interpreter]

najafi, on Nov 19 2006, 02:07 PM, said:

your comments are stupid because if you use just abit of common sense you will see that sayed sadiq is living in iran so of course he can not say things like his brother in public because he will be jailed.also when his brother knows about this video and has not issued an statement against it proves that he just agrees with what sayed mujtaba is saying.

Salaamun Alaikum,

Don't want to jump in between your discussion here but I'd be really worried if the part highlighted in your post is true. As an advice I think it would be wise of you not to speculate, what's at hand as you well know is quite significant.

Wasalaam.